Introducing Onewheel+ XR
@julian thank you for the specs! In the press releases you claim the XR also has more power. Is it the same motor? Or is the better battery allowing the motor to use more of its potential?
@shaka-wheeler think about what apple did to the 3 and then the 4. You could change out the broken screen on a 3 no problem; it was one of the first things to come off the phone so you didn’t have to worry about messing with the components. By 4 or 5 the screen was the final thing you could access and had to completely dismantle the phone to replace the screen. Companies want to retain that power because 1) more revenue, and 2) they control quality of repair. This is not uncommon in the tech world.
@shaka-wheeler the battery in my Prius plug in appears designed to be easily swapped out but now it’s four years old and still the only battery upgrades are very boutique/custom/prohibitively expensive. I am hoping that the aftermarket will still come up with viable options for extending range on both my Prius and my Onewheel+ but I don’t know how long it might take... even with ongoing battery technology advances, designing reliable power storage isn’t easy.
I see that the new OW+XR battery is NMC. I believe the OW+ is a LiFePO4. NMC have great energy density, but limited discharge rates (up to 2C) vs LiFePO4 discharge rates of up to 25C. Hopefully the new battery will be able to supply the brief but very high amperage draws needed for acceleration. As someone who’s been properly injured twice by sudden nosedives, I’m surprised the capacity is only 324Wh. If I’m not mistaken, at 2C maximum discharge rate, an NMC battery of that capacity can only put out 648 watts. Isn’t the motor 750 Watts?
@runtgun are you saying the current battery on + may only be able to supply half the motor’s power? And the XR would be nearing full power? Trying to fully understand your post and wondering if that accounts for the battery sag I’ve felt in the + at lower battery percentages.
@runtgun if you connect cells in parallel you'll get a higher amperage, with a same Wh- rating
Maybe thats how they could compensate for the lower specific power (Max coulomb discharge * Volt: basically the Horsepower rating of a battery).
Im curious to see how they have designed this model, because the motor doesnt just go to 750W on the OW +, it can go above 1000w momentarily. (Electric motors have a designed wattage, and then a floating (mostly temperature constraining) wattage)
Thats how a lot of manufacturers get around european wattage laws on scooter power.
Sell it as a cheap shitty 250W e-bike, and with a software unlock you get a 2500W (very illegal) monster.
@runtgun I want to add to my previous post, as I see now where you went wrong.
Wh = Volts*Amperage * 60 minutes.
I.e a onewheel with a battery of 324Wh , that draws 324 Watts (assuming constant draw) , then you can only power it for an hour.
C = Coulomb, = how many amps each battery cell can supply.
Voltage = how much energy each electron from the battery has.
A quick example.
I have two batteries that both hold 2 Amp hours (Ah)
Battery 1 : 12 V * 2 = 24 Wh
Battery 2 : 100V *2 = 200 Wh
In any case, if I half the voltage, and double the Ah, I will maintain the same Wh rating.
Things are never this simple, but it should give you some intuition to how the different terminologies interplay.
I’m really interested in this too. I’ve found that my + seems to get an unstable amount of current when the battery is lower. I believe it’s relating to voltage sag, but when the board hits a certain load the amps just absolutely spikes/surges. I didn’t think the + battery could sustain enough power/load to the motor. When I heard they changed batteries, I was thinking lipo because it would be able to supply way more power quicker. I was surprised to see they went for these NMC cells
@julian Can you give the Plus specs for a direct comparison?
yeah great news if you dont already own a OW+. For those of us who do, basically we are stuck with a sub-par model. Even worse if we just bought a OW+. Reminds me of the iPhone market, releasing newer and better phones every year, rendering older models extinct.
Guys... An updated model coming out does not render the previous version obsolete. That older model is still just as good as it ever was.
It does hurt when you've just purchased the previous model, but it happens.
I just bought my plus second half of 2017, and I'm personally stoked about the fact that I get to ride it every day until March when my XR comes, and beyond.
It is still the board I paid for, it is still the most fun and awesome thing I own, and I can still go on 10-mile-plus adventures thanks to external battery packs for recharges.
The belly-aching about range envy from plus owners is really getting old. We all got exactly what we paid for. We have something, presently, TODAY, which has no equal or superior that is commercially available. Where exactly is the ripoff?
@cbr-954rr Hope this helps
@julian It definitely helps although Onewheel really has to stop advertising the 20 minute charge time on the plus when we all know it's double that.
What I'm really getting at is: will the charge time on the XR really be 110 minutes or will it be double the advertised number like the plus? And just to clarify, we're talking about 0%-100% charge.
@cbr-954rr Yes, 110min will be your worse case starting at 0% and waiting until 100%
We need a trade in option or people are going to start getting pissed off with these piddly upgrades.
@rockeh start getting pissed? people are already well pissed off, hehe. IMO a trade-in option is really not necessary, from what I've seen original OW and OW+ have a history of reselling pretty easily. With the price of the new board that is not about to change.
@julian Thanks Julian!
Question of curiosity:
What was the biggest development challenge with the XR?
Was the NMC´s Coulomb rating so low that you had to add more than double the Wh to help it keep up with the liFePo4? what was the driving force behind the decision to make the board thicker by the battery compartment?
@cbr-954rr Hey Cbr. I can promise you, without a shadow of a doubt that (ok maybe some doubt):
A: Charging will probably be higher, maybe starting around the 2 hour mark.
B: As soon as the first boards start shipping out, you will get that answered by the amazing community here.
@braswell I'm glad someone else out there can think logically when it comes to this stuff. I bought the + in June and could very easily be a bit salty a new version is announced 6 months later, but its the nature of the beast. Your examples are spot on, and people really need to start realizing that.