Wider stance, less speed?

  • I'm just wondering if anyone wants to chime in on my theory about stance. So when I first started riding I had very little trouble getting the thing in the 20's. But as I got more comfortable and learning my stance I notice I have a wider stance. My speeds have dropped and it seems the board is having trouble in high speed keeping the nose up and usually end up going into a nosedive. I'm assuming my stance has a lot to do with how much the motor has to work because the more weight on the front the more the power the motor has to provide to keep the nose up. Has anyone else played with stance and came to a conclusion what is optimal?

  • A wider stance should give you less top speed and a higher chance of nosediving.

    The board uses torque from the motor to keep you balanced. Several times a second it is adding more or less torque in response to your weight distribution to keep you balanced.

    Now, we know that torque is a force times a distance. If you were a super skilled gymnast, you'd be able to keep exactly 50% of your weight in each side of the board, and the motor wouldn't need to balance you at all. But that is not the reality. We can't balance perfectly and we will always have slightly more force pushing on one side than on the other. This force will generate a torque around the center of the wheel, and the motor will need to compensate that with a torque in the opposite direction to keep you balanced. If your feet is closer to the wheel, the resulting torque will be smaller than if they were further apart, as the resulting torque is proportional to the distance.

    So, if your feet are closer, the motor will be using less resources to keep you balanced, and thus will have more resources to make you go faster.

  • What @lirou said!

  • @lirou how would you know I'm not a world class gymnist? 😁 This is what I was assuming was going. At first I thought my board had lost some power from the batteries or the C rating had gone down since first use. Not realizing that I had begun to widen my stance more and more, I started to lose speed and was actually taking some pretty hard nosedives. I'm going to play with stance more and try to find a balance. I feel a wider stance increased stability and agility but a close stance would increase speed and possibly even safer because your giving the motor more room to make corrections before it starts pushing back. Thanks for the info!

  • @vspot415, @lirou nailed it. I like speed so I try to keep my stance as narrow as possible. At a point if I go too narrow it takes a lot more force / effort on my part to keep the board level (which I find uncomfortable), so the sweet spot for me is just on the inside of that, where my body weight does most of the work. Weight is also a factor in all of this. At #209 I can hit 17-18 no problem and to go faster, I'd narrow my stance.

  • Interesting discussion.
    Didn't realize that.
    I tend to ride as wide as possible.
    Guess that's why I can't go past 16 mph.

  • @sonny123 I know your the go to for experimentation and modding, try out some different stances and see what you get. I haven't had a chance yet but I'm gonna report back after I get the data

  • @sonny123 try moving your rear foot closer to the wheel- you'll quickly notice the difference- board feels like it found another gear.

  • @groovyruvy

    You are correct.
    Just tried it on my 13" mod and picked up couple more miles.
    Gonna try it on the +

  • If we assume the same force is applied at different distances from the fulcrum point, then of course the shorter the distance the less torque is created, but having feet closer together reduces your ability for fine balance. That's what the wide stance gives you - greater range over the amount of force applied to each end, ability to quickly shift weight and as a result better balance control. When on a moving ship, bus or train or when someone tries to push us off balance the natural response is to widen our stance. I find fighting stance to be most comfortable with front foot heel being under front shoulder and back foot toe under the back shoulder. Spreading your hands is natural when going over obstacles on OW because we can extend them even further out to balance. Even the poles used by wire walkers have weights on their ends, so a wider stance seems better to me as long as it's comfortable.

  • @sfctac

    Wider = better for balance & control (for all reasons you mentioned)
    Narrower = better for speed because less work from motor is going into balance

  • @skyman88 It's less work for the motor assuming the same force is applied at different distances from the wheel. This is an incorrect assumption. With wider stance we get better balance and have better control over amount of pressure applied in any direction. I argue, that with a wider stance I need to apply less pressure to start moving. I can also get maximum acceleration from the motor with a wider stance because I can force the front pad all the way down, scraping the ground. Similarly I can slam the tail on the ground if emergency breaking is required. Both of these would be more difficult with a narrow stance.

    Wider stance is not only more stable but also gives us a lower center of gravity and encourages us to lower it further by bending our keens, these give us better chances for recovery in case of malfunction.

  • @sfctac

    To clarify when I said speed I meant top speed (ft/s or mile/hour).

    I agree that the wider stance helps with better control of acceleration (derivative of speed, rate of change of speed, ft/s^2) but is a detractor from top speed.

    I think we are actually in full agreement on this one. Wider gives you better control, no argument there.

  • @skyman88 you got it. Wider stance = more control, however it also = increased chances of nosedives. Narrower stance = more speed, however it also = less control. IMO the key for each rider is to find that sweet spot where the stance is such that you're feeling full control over the board, not always on the edge of a nosedive, yet still able to hit those higher speeds. For me that translates into a stance that delivers 17mph no problem, with my feet just wide enough to be able to really carve the heck out of the board, and I rarely nosedive as it's not a really wide stance. PS I weigh 209#

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